Template talk:Mechanics

Sorting

Just wanted to offer a quick explanation as to why I chose the sorting method I did. It would also be possible and valid to sort these abilities by static/triggered/activated qualities, but I think that those qualities are already intuitively obvious. The distinction between keywords and ability words is harder to convey, and I think this sorting helps to explain that, and I think that education opportunity outweighs any initial confusion that may result from that organization. Separating evergreen keywords also supports that goal by chunking out transient, block-level mechanics. --Corveroth (talk) 00:37, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Your classification was very nice and polished. I liked it, but I decided to add also the static/triggered/activated qualities for more options. I think that in the next few years will be a lot more keywords and thus, more keywords will demand more options to achieve clarity. If someone doesn't like it, is free from reversing that version and I won't worry. --Tuamir (talk) 08:43, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

I think this sorting is useful, but not in the navbox. Navboxes exist to help users explore related topics, and excessive categorization, perhaps untuitively, makes it harder to find things - you need to find the correct category and then the correct entry, rather than just finding the entry. There's also the issue of making the topic seem overwhelming, because now a cursory glance reveals not just variety, but additional classifications to be learned. (Not to mention that this iteration fills a majority of the screen on either of my monitors. That's a lot of screen real-estate!)

I think what we really need here is a proper Portal page for Rules topics, and the work you did to categorize these would help a lot in building one. I do want to revert this, but I'm going to park a copy of this on the Sandbox page for later reference.

With the exception of landhome, none of the entries in "commonly unkeyworded" are keywords or ability words. They really don't belong here, but they might belong in a somewhat similar navbox covering gameplay/metagame/slang or something in that range of topics. Similarly, while the "unreleased" group fits here, those pages are also prime candidates for inclusion in an R&D-centric category/navbox. --Corveroth (talk) 09:05, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Talking about categories. I think we shouldn't have the category Keyword and category Keyword/triggered on the same page. Logically speaking, the second is a subcategory of the other --Hunter (talk) 12:42, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Ante edits

Recently, an anonymous editor has been moving the link for ante up out of the "Obsolete" category. Both Yanderesliver and myself have reverted these edits. I believe the two of us are on the same page here: ante is "strictly forbidden" by the Tournament Rules, all cards with ante are banned in all formats, and the optional gameplay variant is subject to restriction by local laws, which overrule anything in any game document. That being said, ante is, technically, still in the rules, and in a compliant jurisdiction, players can still play unsanctioned games using it.

From the Comprehensive Rules (June 7, 2024—Modern Horizons 3)

• 407. Ante
  • 407.1. Earlier versions of the Magic rules included an ante rule as a way of playing “for keeps.” Playing Magic games for ante is now considered an optional variation on the game, and it’s allowed only where it’s not forbidden by law or by other rules. Playing for ante is strictly forbidden under the Magic: The Gathering Tournament Rules (WPN.Wizards.com/en/resources/rules-documents).
  • 407.2. When playing for ante, each player puts one random card from their deck into the ante zone after determining which player goes first but before players draw any cards. Cards in the ante zone may be examined by any player at any time. At the end of the game, the winner becomes the owner of all the cards in the ante zone.
  • 407.3. A few cards have the text “Remove [this card] from your deck before playing if you’re not playing for ante.” These are the only cards that can add or remove cards from the ante zone or change a card’s owner. When not playing for ante, players can’t include these cards in their decks or sideboards, and these cards can’t be brought into the game from outside the game.
  • 407.4. To ante an object is to put that object into the ante zone from whichever zone it’s currently in. The owner of an object is the only person who can ante that object.

Rather than start an edit war, or protect the page unnecessarily, I'd like to open a discussion on the topic. Editors of this wiki, including the anonymous editor responsible for these edits, where does ante belong in this navbox? --Corveroth (talk) 03:00, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

Good question. Ante is the only 11 on the storm scale which goes to 10. They really really do not want to bring that back. I think the only reason they still have rules for it in the document is that the ante cards were printed in black border. All references to silver border rules were removed, because well they are silly. We also describe a few things as obsolete in the wiki, which are still on cards. (Even tournament legal cards like +2/+0 counter.) - Yandere Sliver 16:04, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

Ante is "only" a 10, perhaps surprisingly. Bands with others is the only 11. I've been mulling over some other ideas for those last two categories, but none of them address the original question of whether ante belongs with the regular keywords, or with the entries that aren't actually part of the game. --Corveroth (talk) 17:51, 12 May 2017 (UTC)